Suzanne Proksa:
Welcome to The Suzanne Show with me, Suzanne Proxa, HR and business strategist, former featured Etsy seller, plant addict, concert lover, gardener, landscaper in training, and human straight up obsessed with helping others and cheering on women. Here, we talk a little business, personal development, women's health, and a whole lot about things that matter, help people, and give them joy. Grab your coffee or your wine. Break out one of your hundreds of notebooks, light that soy candle, and let's dive in. Friends, today, we are talking about a topic near and dear to my heart. If you follow me on LinkedIn, you know this, you know this so much. Look, today we are talking with Meredith brown about menopause in the workplace. Meredith is an equity diversity inclusion specialist and menopause trainer with over 20 years of experience in the public and private sectors.
Suzanne Proksa:
So, Meredith, I am going to have you finish the introduction and it. Let people know about your experience and all of that good stuff before we start to dive into questions. So I will turn it over to you.
Meredith Brown:
Thank you so much, Suzanne. It's great to be on your podcast talking about this really important topic of menopause. I think sometimes we forget or people just don't realize that over half the population will go through menopause, And every one of us will know at least 1 person going through this natural life transition right now. To be a partner, sister, mother, friend, work colleague, you may not have even realized it. And just to have an understanding and Appreciation of menopause is so important. As you said, I've worked for many years as an equity, diversity, an inclusion specialist. My menopause trainer, and I've talked to countless women going through menopause about their challenges and struggles to manage menopausal symptoms, just not feeling like themselves. And this is during what can often be a really busy And sometimes quite stressful time of their lives.
Meredith Brown:
And I cofounded Menopause 51 was 51 because the average age of menopause in the UK It's 51, and the percentage of population who will go through menopause is 51%. And Menopause 51 is an organisation that supports employers And leaders to build menopause confident and inclusive workplaces. And one of the biggest things is education and awareness. Breaking down the stigma, starting to encourage the dialogue around menopause, which is why podcasts like these, which can reach lots of people Have lots of rich information within them are just so important. I'm also going through my own menopause journey. I've had my own struggles, Sometimes battling just to get up each day, but being surrounded by supportive people can make all the difference. And I know I'm really fortunate in that sense. I have 2 teenage boys, and I'm constantly talking to them about menopause.
Meredith Brown:
And I hope that the next generation Will be better educated and connected when it comes to menopause.
Suzanne Proksa:
Thank you for tidying up that intro for me. Thank you. Thank you. So Interesting statistic. Menopausal women are the fastest growing workforce demographic with over 80%. That's right. 80% saying that menopausal symptoms negatively affect work. That is huge.
Suzanne Proksa:
It's significant. I am also very much aware that there are women who leave talented women who leave the workforce because of this. This is something I do a lot of sharing about menopause on LinkedIn. And sadly, we are in a place where I have over 4,000 followers and I rarely get comments, anything on it. People really, I think They either don't know what to do or they look the other way. And the problem is that as we're going through this as women, We're no less talented. We're no less talented. We can still do our jobs.
Suzanne Proksa:
We can still do all the things. We just need some support. We just need a little bit of support. So my first question to Meredith is Why is a focus on menopause in the workplace important?
Meredith Brown:
That is such a great question, Suzanne, you know, and you've Already shared some of the hard hitting facts that menopausal women are the fastest growing workforce demographic. Women are staying on work longer, and we're also seeing them return after periods of absence. We know that 8 out of 10 menopausal women are in work. And as she said, over 80 10 have shared that menopausal symptoms can have a negative impact on what, and yet we know that most of these women feel that there's no one in The workplace I can turn to for support, and this is having a really big impact on well-being and performance. And a free thing about the impacts on the organization, this comes through staff absence. Studies have shown that 30% of menopausal workers Taking time off because they've been struggling to manage their symptoms. And these workers don't give the true reason for their absence. And so it's masking the impact that menopause is having in the workplace.
Meredith Brown:
Retention is also a big impact. 25% of menopausal workers consider leaving the workplace. 10% do. And as you said, these are talented women. It's a huge loss of experience and knowledge and skills. And for those that do stay, many will look to go part time To reduce their hours to to help manage the stress and anxiety. Or some may decide not to go for promotion. And this can all affect gender diversity often at those senior levels where organizations are really struggling to achieve gender balance.
Meredith Brown:
It can also have an impact on attraction. The candidates, they want to know that their employer is gonna support them through the challenging times in their times in their lives. Now this can, I think, paint quite a bleak picture? However, what's really important to remember is that for most People relatively simple, low cost support and adjustments can be put in place in the working environment, which can help these symptoms and can see people continue to thrive in their role. And I think, actually, interestingly, I just wanna Pick up on that point you shared on posting about menopause in LinkedIn and finding that you're not getting much engagement. That's and and that's to, You know, I I think, curiously, I said, well, why is that? Is that because people don't feel comfortable or safe talking about it? And we know that there are a lot of people that Still don't feel safe talking up about menopause. You're worried about the impact that's gonna have, how people might see them differently or look at them differently, Or is it perhaps that they don't feel they don't understand menopause? They don't know the language well enough to be able to be part of the conversation, so that's really the awareness piece? Or is it that they just don't feel that it impacts them? And yet the thing about menopause is that it does impact everybody. That may be The only woman and some of the non binary and trans community will directly go through menopause, but it doesn't fit those around them as well.
Suzanne Proksa:
Thank you so much for explaining the importance of focusing on this topic. What is the value of actually putting resources into supporting menopausal workers? I mean, Let's let's look at 2 points of view. Right? The the value to the worker and the value to the employer. If you can kinda separate those 2, that would be
Meredith Brown:
fantastic. So I've already mentioned some of the value and benefits to the employer, and I think we're seeing a growing Ignition and acknowledgement from organizations that putting time and resource into supporting menopausal workers is beneficial for all the reasons that I've mentioned, including engagement and performance for employees and for menopausal work, such as positive benefits on their well-being, On their ability to be able to stay in a job and a career that they've likely invested a lot of time and energy into achieving. So there are over 34 menopausal symptoms, physical and psychological, and 75% of women will experience symptoms. 25% will experienced debilitating symptoms on a daily basis. And some of the more common symptoms that are talked about in the workplace of the hot flushes, brain fog, anxiety, fatigue, poor concentration. And, yes, there are things around life style, you know, diet, exercise, minimizing stress, talking to a house professional about medication such as hormone replacement therapy, That woman can consider to help manage their symptoms. But then alongside this, employers need to be supporting Menopausal workers will be fostering a menopause considerate environment, which will help ease the symptoms, reduce stress, reduce anxiety. And it can mean the difference between someone experiencing a real drop in their self esteem They're not feeling like they're themselves, not feeling like they're good enough.
Meredith Brown:
No. Really seeing a plummet in their confidence, Taking large amounts of leave, perhaps quitting their job in the extreme, maybe finding themselves on some performance action plan for the 1st time in their lives, which in itself was incredibly stressful or continuing to sort of thrive And, you know, being able to give of their best in their
Suzanne Proksa:
role. Thank you so much for that. You know, it seems like it's one of those things where We shouldn't need to be told what the value is, but it just is what it is. Right? You know, based on what I said earlier, what what do we know about how menopausal symptoms impact work.
Meredith Brown:
Okay. So the majority of women will go through menopause between the ages of 45 and 55. Menopausal symptoms start, on average, 4 to 6 years before menopause, which is actually just a point in time And can continue for another 5 to 7 years after menopause, but can be up to 12 years or even longer. So what's important for leaders and managers Realise is that menopause is not necessarily something which will pass in, say, 12 months. It's also unique to the individual. So everyone's gonna experience a different combination of menopausal symptoms and at different intensities, and these can vary over time. So when thinking about the impact and the support, this can change over time and won't necessarily be the same for 2 people. Some of the impacts include the hot flushes.
Meredith Brown:
So this can be really uncomfortable. You feel like you're burning up inside. And also, women feel very self conscious. You know, are people noticing? What are they thinking? What if they say something? What will I do? And this can cause high levels of anxiety, and anxiety can impact lots of different situations in the workplace. Difficulty recalling or remembering information It's a really common symptom that many women struggle with in the workplace, where previously they had been able to pull information from lots of different sources, remember things that they've learned. They can find that more challenging. Reduced levels of estrogen impact areas of the brain that are involved in learning and memory. Lower levels of concentration.
Meredith Brown:
So people find it more difficult to focus, particularly if the working environment's quite busy, lots of distractions around them. This can all be made worse, of course, by fatigue. So people can be really tired. They may be suffering from insomnia. Night Switch during the night might mean that they're not sleeping very well. Mood swings is another big impact. So people can be feeling fine 1 minute, Then perhaps irritable the next or tearful. It can be really difficult on relationships.
Meredith Brown:
And some women will actually withdraw into themselves and then be less interactive, And it just affects their confidence. Aching and painful joints is another one that's probably worth mentioning. You know, Particularly, if you're having to sit for long periods of time, it can be really difficult. Now if you have back to back meetings or really long meetings without a comfort break, that can make those sorts some symptoms a lot less.
Suzanne Proksa:
Thank you so much for sharing that information. That was such a great overview view of what women can go through in the workplace. I really just have this feeling that part of the reason why this topic is just, It it almost seems like some people are scared of it is a lack of understanding. I mean, how what do you think about that? I I think people don't know what the symptoms are. I don't think they know what women are going through, and I don't think I don't think they know how to
Meredith Brown:
help. Yes. I completely agree, Suzanne. You know, when you're thinking about How can I support a more menopause inclusive environment? It is about building your own knowledge And understanding of menopause and the impact of, listening to podcasts like this one, encouraging others to do the same. Now this is gonna enable you to feel more confident in part of the conversation. I would suggest, you know, finding opportunities to about menopause to really break down the stigma in your workplace. Open up the dialogue amongst colleagues. Get people talking about menopause.
Meredith Brown:
Get involved in any workplace activities. That's about setting up a menopause group, supportive community where menopausal staff can can come together. And if you feel comfortable doing so, sharing your own story could be really, really powerful, either of your own transition or perhaps supporting someone else Going through menopause. This just lets people know that it's okay to speak up. Culture is such a big part of a menopause friendly workplace. Now having the workplace adjustments and the support in place, that's vital. However, you also need people to feel safe Speaking up. So you've got to set that positive supportive tone when you're talking about menopause, which really builds that trust.
Meredith Brown:
Just being there, listening to colleagues who want to talk about their experience, who don't dismiss how they're feeling, you know, acknowledge their challenges. It's really important as well to call out inappropriate jokes or banter in the workplace directed at menopausal workers. Because silence, well, essentially that's speaking acceptance, isn't it? And it's just not acceptable. So it's about being curious. It's about wanting to learn. It's about being a little bit vulnerable, actually, in an unfamiliar area, But just being willing to build your knowledge, to take those 1st steps, those 2nd steps, those 3rd steps. No wanting to understand what colleagues are going through, being considerate, and it becomes easier. It becomes more natural.
Meredith Brown:
Conversation becomes normalized, which is exactly where you want it to
Suzanne Proksa:
be. I appreciate your insights so much on that. So next, how can employers then build a menopause inclusive workplace. Is this something that's hard to do? Are there some simple things that employers can can start with to at least start going in a more positive
Meredith Brown:
direction. Absolutely. I mean, I would say that the first place to start is awareness and education, and ideally across all staff. This is where many of our clients begin a general, awareness raising talk, Breaking down the stigma, busting the mess around menopause, sharing information about what menopause is, what are the common symptoms, what impact does it have in the workplace, and just Starting the conversation. Upskilling managers to have sense of menopause conversations is also important, No. So they can talk about adjustments and support. Many managers are concerned that they're gonna say the wrong thing, perhaps offend a colleague. So it's important to get them comfortable and to understand what their responsibilities are.
Meredith Brown:
I've touched on setting up supportive communities like a menopause group or a menopause network. And this allows people to come together to share experiences, to exchange ideas, Just really to not feel so alone on their journey. Some organizations also appoint menopause champions, and these are people that have a Deep knowledge of menopause. They understand the challenges within their workplace. They can talk about and signpost support. So it's like a 1 to 1 confidential conversation. It can be really helpful, particularly if someone doesn't feel ready to talk to their manager or to HR, and we train menopause champions for this role. You can also run women only workshops.
Meredith Brown:
We have a workshop which goes more deeply Into the changes that are happening during menopause and the variety of symptoms and how to manage these. Nice safe space, really, for exploring and reflecting On your own menopause journey and addressing your own challenges. And what's really important is to be giving the information so that women can be making form decisions which are right for them and which are gonna help, you know, their symptoms in the context in which their their lives are set. The other thing to mention is is creating menopause policy or guidance. Great way to share useful information, signpost adjustments and supports, can set a positive tone around menopause, about being supportive, about being a menopause inclusive workplace. So then you've you've got the structure, you've got clarity, And it sort of wrapped around with building up the right behaviors and mindset. So you've got that that inclusive and confident menopause culture.
Suzanne Proksa:
So, Meredith, since we have you, on the flip side of this, we've talked quite a bit about workplaces and employers. Wait. There's the woman who's sitting in that chair trying to work through all of these symptoms, either not getting support, or maybe they are getting some support. What do you say to them? What will help them During this time, do you think there's something they can do at work outside of work? What kind of resources do you suggest? Because it is incredibly impactful, and there are just so many different
Meredith Brown:
symptoms. First of all, I just say That it's okay to not feel okay. Now we often put a lot of pressure on ourselves, and it's about Having some self compassion and showing some kindness to yourself at this time. You might wanna take a look at lifestyle. So how balanced is your diet? How often do you get out and exercise? I know this can be difficult, Ticked if you're feeling tired and you don't have much energy or you're suffering from low mood. You know, just try and find something you enjoy. Start small. Perhaps do it with someone else that might be helpful.
Meredith Brown:
How are you managing your stress levels? You know? So what is it that relaxes you, And how are you building this into your day? Book an appointment to see your health professional, your GP, I talk about medication, therapy, supplements, other things that might be available and suitable for you. To hormone replacement therapy, cognitive behavioral therapy, for example, in the workplace. You find someone you're comfortable talking to. And if that's not your manager, then maybe a colleague, maybe HR, someone in your gender network, if you have a gender or a or a all age generations network, At your employee assistance program, and if it's something that you're really passionate about and you'd like to drive a focus on it in your workplace, and there's not a lot going on at the moment, Then find others who have a similar interest. Form a group and start to understand the needs of those in your organization. Find a senior sponsor to help grow your voice.
Suzanne Proksa:
Meredith, thank you so much for giving that insight. So There might be companies out there now who are thinking, okay, I really do want to start putting some focus on this Now that they have a better understanding and they probably wanna know how to reach out to you. So how, where do they find you? How do they reach out to you? How can you help them start to put a program in
Meredith Brown:
place? Firstly, that's Brilliant that you're looking to shape your menopause agenda and support the well-being of those going through this natural life transition. You can get in contact with myself at Menopause 51 through emailing me at meridis, m e r e [email protected]. So that's meridusat menopause 51.com. You can also check out our website which is www.menopause51.com. Lots of useful information on our website, including what programs we offer, all of which we tailor to our individual clients. You can also follow us on LinkedIn. When we first start working with a client, we like to have a conversation to better understand the organization. What are your objectives? What are the foundations you need to build? What might the barriers be? How can we address these? Who do we need to upskill? What processes do you need to put in place? Now there's lots to look at and consider against the backdrop of your organization and culture so that we can use all of this information To formulate the best way forward for you and tailor any program that we deliver.
Suzanne Proksa:
Thank you so much, Meredith, for being here. 1 to 2 things that you would like the audience to take away from this episode. What would those
Meredith Brown:
be? Oh, 1 or 2 takeaways. Well, firstly, I would say, as an employer, this isn't something that you can ignore. Not only is supporting women as they go through menopause the right thing to do, It makes good business sense and has many positive benefits. Secondly, I would say make start By hosting a session that raises awareness of menopause and its impact in the workplace across all of your staff, and tap into your staff networks or other forums To understand the challenges that menopausal workers are facing in your workplace and put in place adjustments and support that will help to ease And manage
Suzanne Proksa:
symptoms. Thank you so much for those takeaways. Absolute gold here in this episode. Again, you can tell I'm incredibly passionate about this topic. And I am so grateful for your time here, Meredith. Blessed that you decided to be on the Suzanne show, and I look so forward to talking to you soon. Have a great rest of your day.
Meredith Brown:
Thank you so much for having me, Suzanne. It was a real pleasure to talk to you today. I hope people found the conversation informative and useful. I hope people share what they've learned today with others or share the link to the podcast. We all need to be part of raising the voice around menopause and opening up the menopause conversation.
